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With a long track record in triple-A development and a current focus on future trends and creative opportunities at Studio Ellipsis, the Lisbon-based studio head delivered a talk titled “From AAA to Ashes: Why the Future Belongs to the Bold.” After his session, Alex Amancio and Gamereactor’s David Caballero caught up to dive deeper into the ideas he presented and to discuss the studio’s latest projects.
"Hi Gamereactor friends, this is day 2 at the DevGAMM in Lisbon and I'm here joined by Alex I was looking forward to this one, I couldn't attend your panel earlier today It was kind of a keynote on creativity and actually the current state of the industry You talked about over-expansion, creative stagnation and disconnect from studios to players So that's three very interesting topics Which would you say was the main takeaway? All in all, you had some Q&A Like the message you conveyed to these young developers gathered here I think that we are coming out of one of the biggest successful runs that this industry has ever seen Like super expansion and with it comes a lot of inherent issues By growing very fast, projects also grew very very fast and a lot of people And when you grow to having a lot of people creating a project You sometimes lose the central creative vision And you sometimes lose the ability to kind of be very precise and very concise in that vision You bloat and also budgets become higher and higher And so you become more and more avert to risk And the combination of that is what I think part of what led to where we are today So I think that the takeaway is focus on small creative nuclei with a strong vision Focus on trying to predict the future trends rather than chasing trends And also focus on excellence This is also something that in the past years sadly we've kind of strayed a little away from We've exchanged complacency like excellence for complacency And I think that refocusing on our core passion where we all join this industry is super important And you know if we do that we focus on smaller creative teams on pure vision And on the search for excellence I think that will lead the way to a bright future for this industry You mentioned creative stagnation But I guess you meant more coming from AA and AAA projects rather than smaller indie games Because we didn't see actually that you know from the pandemic and up until this day And many of the nominees for today's awards they look very fresh We still see a lot of new ideas coming from indie So I guess you mean more by big publishers and bigger teams Yes and absolutely right And I think that that duality and that creative synergy between bigger AA or AAA studios That kind of are the engine for scope and like massive like polish and quality And the relationship with small indies that are pushing innovation That virtuous circle has to be amplified in our industry And if anything I think that yes even though the AAA industry has been kind of like shrinking a little bit lately If you look at the indie scene it's been expanding But that also comes at a price If you look at the number of games released on Steam I think it was if I remember correctly like something like close to 1600 this year It also means dilution It means that we are you know growing closer to the music industry In the sense that discoverability is becoming a problem And if you look at most games that come out on Steam The amount of games that actually make the $100 that it takes to actually be on Steam is quite low And so even though the indie scene is thriving it also has its own issues And again talking about bigger companies How would you solve over expansion and scalability?
Is co-dev a solution to studios trying to make really big games That perhaps they need support from other companies Instead of scale up and down which they always struggle to do Yeah that's a really good point And if you look at the way the movie industry evolved And I give it as an example I know that a lot of people give it as an example It's almost like the example to follow That's not at all what I'm saying And you know the gaming industry is bigger than the movie industry But there are some elements that we can learn from an industry like that If you look at the way they operate There's small creative teams that are responsible for a project And then what they do is there's a lot of people that are kind of Almost like outsourcers, like teams that they will kind of hire for a project And then the project grows when it needs to grow It contracts when it needs to contract So not only using co-dev but also using outsourcing I think is the key I think that core teams should be at a human size And then those core teams should be complemented by either co-dev And or outsourcing when the needs are there And by having it done this way It actually gives more breathing room for the core teams to actually develop In the right way Because when you have like Personally I can speak from example I've had a team like my biggest one was like a thousand person team A thousand Where?
It was at Ubisoft And when you think about it It's like having a train And the locomotive is the creative team The core team that's pushing it forward Because you have these attached components to the train wagons Like wagons tied to the train Each of them has its own constraints Some of them want to move faster than the locomotive Some of them want to move slower So by detaching these and having a leaner kind of train Like a small locomotive And then attaching the components when you need And detaching them when you need I think is going to make the overall process a lot smoother That's interesting And the comparison with the train Yeah, you have a very interesting background You've mentioned Ubisoft You've worked with AAA in the past But let's talk present and future You run Studio Ellipsis And there's a couple of projects I've seen that you guys are working on That strike to me as very You know, visually striking or impacting And they're very different One is almost not even a video game And the other one is 3D and it's completely different First of all, Nightholme You're running a closed beta?
Not yet, we've just announced You announced it?
What can you tell me about the main concept of the game?
Is it horror? Is it action?
It is, it's a horror game It's an action game with stealth elements And it's a multiplayer game And I find it very Always a double-edged sword To talk about key buzz terms like PvE or PvP Because people assume things The game we're making is a game where You and a couple of friends Like three players Go into a map to hunt a monster Like you're bounty hunters In order to do so There's no weapons in the game No guns, no weapons It's third person and it's action You need to transform into a monster to fight monsters Anybody can transform into any archetype of monster And different monsters have different powers Different strengths And represent different archetypes And other hunters are also after the monster Which is where the tension comes from But some players could ignore other players Stay hidden and try to get to the monster Other ones could try to hunt other players But that is just part of the core horror experience Another really interesting element that we have is that All of the progression happens in the match So unlike games where A 55 level player is not going to play with a 2 level player In this stage we're all evened out And you go in weak and you level up Like in a MOBA Within the match And yeah, so that's kind of the Big overarching picture of the game And we really want the game to be A game that people can play the way they want And some players might even have Other missions than only the mission That is being offered by destroying the monster Some players might have You know, we have different stores That offer different products Like one of the storekeepers might have Given one player the mission of Hey, if you go under the church There's like a crypt there And there's a dying entity If you capture its dying breath And bring it to me I will give you a reward And that's how you deliver the lore?
Yes, exactly The lore is delivered by The storekeepers, by the metagame And there's a rich metagame That we haven't yet talked about But that kind of encapsulates the game You haven't yet talked about But what is sort of the setting Or the inspiration that you can tell me now?
Yeah, so we built a really deep horror lore It's a cosmic horror game And each hunter has their own kind of hub It's unique to you It's a 3D space that belongs to you That will resemble the progression That you're making in the game Through that hub You can access the game world Through a portal like the missions But there's also different stores There's a central one That kind of represents the people That give you the missions To go and kill these monsters But then we have kind of two alignments In our game And it's not good and evil It's all evil This is a horror game But it's kind of two sources of power You have planar powers And you have voidal powers And each monster archetype belongs To either one of these worlds And each of these stores Has a very different feel And very different types of missions And type of rewards The voidal one is more about Loss of self and madness The planar one is more about Blood and sacrifice And another element That I can maybe reveal Is that we do have As I mentioned The progression happens in match But there is a meta progression So as a player that's been playing A long time There is some benefits That you can get Versus other players Cosmetics?
Not only cosmetics There's We have this thing called The bindling Which is Kind of think of it Like a voodoo doll And there's many different types And you can tear them apart And sew different parts together And then the voodoo doll Can have attachments And the monsters that you beat Are unique monsters And they each have specific Powers and specific abilities By attaching the seed Of these monsters Into different parts It can give you benefits Like I don't know If you attach a certain seed To one of the hands Of one of the bindlings Maybe it gives you A 15% bleeding effect On attacks So it can give you A special defense It can give you A bit of a You know Advantage over the others Exactly Alright This is like Luigi's Mansion meets Phasmophobia meets I don't know It's stealthy as well You think you are Predicting some trends here With action Multiplayer action Horror stealth game We're letting our passion Lead the way We're not trying to copy We're honestly And like truly Trying to do something That we would play as a team And if that can predict The pattern Because we are players First and foremost Before being developers Then yes We're hoping Then it's welcome Alright And the other project That I want to ask you about Is Cradle of the Gods If I'm correct That's the name And you know You told me It's pretty much a comic And we've been doing A lot of comic this year I think it's this year We've covered more comic ever In Gamereactor We've been to the COMICON in Naples To the San Diego Comic Con in Malaga We've been close to artists So what sort of product is this?
What do you want to express here?
What do you want to convey?
What are you pursuing?
Being sort of a transmedia studio With this project Which looks fantastic So Cradle of the Gods Is exactly part of The initiative that you were mentioning This being a transmedia studio What we want to be Is a studio that Supports creatives That we focus on building worlds And we focus on supporting creatives The people that have made Cradle of the Gods with us The amazing writers and artists Are people that we believe in And we also at the studio Believe in building worlds And even interconnecting worlds So maybe if you read Cradle of the Gods There might be clues there That perhaps the worlds Of Nightholme and Cradle of the Gods Are somehow in the same universe Alright And so Cradle of the Gods Is the first initiative In this kind of world building initiative That we're trying to do Where we're trying to empower creatives So if this works It becomes also a platform for us To kind of test out worlds And ideas that we have Before investing more And in doing so Doing so by empowering creatives So right now Cradle of the Gods is free You can read all episodes But we are doing A graphic novel A physical graphic novel And this is a Kickstarter And I would invite everybody Go to Kickstarter And support the project If you like the project You can read it for free But by supporting the project The message you're sending to us Is that our bet On supporting creatives And on experimenting With world building And on interconnecting worlds Is the right way to go And if it works In the future We'll have a lot more Projects like this A lot more comics That we'll give for free And we'll allow people To kind of support it On Kickstarter For like a physical version Which is our way Of testing out our beliefs With the audience Yeah and I guess Exactly And I guess it's also A way to engage with them And to get feedback At the same time I was going to ask you About the formats But you answered that already Okay and anything else That you would like to mention About Studio Ellipsis Where are you guys based?
How does the team look?
What are the projects That you would like to bring up?
We're based in Lisbon And the team is international It literally is the United Nations We have people from a lot of places Some people already lived in Lisbon Some people are expats And we have local Portuguese people We really see ourselves As what I hope is A new emerging trend Of small boutique studios And you mentioned something That just before That is super critical And important for us Establishing a communication With the community Not only is your right Cradle of the Gods is a way for us To establish a direct line But even the way That we're presenting Nightholme We want to make this different We're going to show stuff That is work in progress We're not going to be afraid To show footage That is pre-alpha That is not perfect A lot of I think that a lot of One of the mistakes That we've made I think collectively Myself included in the industry Is that we It's almost like we try To guard stuff too much And over promise When in fact I think that players Respect being part of the journey I want players to see Where we're coming from How the ideas evolved Why we are where we are Where we're heading And see that happen Almost in real time And not just through early access But also through Development proper Yes, yes Alright, that's very interesting So are there more chances We will see you next at GDC Or at a Comic Con?
Probably at a Comic Con At GDC as well And you know We'll obviously have a chance Maybe to talk again And you're more than welcome To come to the studio If you want to visit It's been a pleasure Obrigado Thank you"
